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Re: 18TH's Oct Game
The Neck (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 13:46
Thats been the main problem so far...I'm living in ireland so cant play every week so thats 1 front row player down for a start. And p is injured and looks like hes gonna be out for a while

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Bluthrunthru (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 14:59
Well said Bagpuss.Some people posting on here are,Natural Born Idiots.Didnt play in the game you mentioned but as you know I have played in others and it leaves a bitter taste. Are we doing any training cos I need some exercise(LOTS)

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Bluthrunthru (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 17:57
Just seen the Mail.Cant work out if Kelly is having a slight dig re pulling the no front row trick.Seems strange as he has been very voiciferous in his support of Tech in recent weeks.

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
centre (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 19:06
whilst not happy at cancelling games at the last minute ie saturday, it is a decision which is not taken lightly and a decision that is generally out of our hands ie no front row or a severe lack of players.
What can not be forgotten is that this has not just suddenly happened. We struggled for the whole of last season, granted we did fulfill our fixtures but did so with a very small squad. The squad has since been depleated through retirement and a couple of players moving on. We will suffer further through the loss of mixie when he relocates due to work.
A decision was made a month ago to give it a try and to review the situation this week. We have attracted a couple of players and all are benefitting from howies excellent coaching (cant understand why any club would let the guy go??), however we have only fulfilled one fixture and have disappointed a lot of people along the way.

A decsion has to and will be made.

ps i agree that the kelly did have an unfair pop at the club, thankfully it will have only been seen by the 20 or so who pay 30p for the 4 sheets of paper.

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
The Neck (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 20:45
Im availble for the game a week on sat if that helps

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Peter Wilkinson (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 22:39
Loaning would be down to the individual,an approach would need to be made to clubs then its up to that player and to be honest most are happy playing and hoping for promotion at their own clubs.
Hoping it all works out soon :-)

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Ozob (IP Logged)
21 October, 2008 23:23
Lack of a front row and a replacement front row player is not a reason for not fulfilling a fixture.......

the game should still go ahead.....

it starts with uncontested scrums......

that way everyone gets a game of rugby.

It goes down as a 0 - 0 score with the team who did provide a front row and front row cover being awarded the 2 points

the ref marks the match card accordingly...

in the event of that result affecting any teams promotion or relegation, the Northern Competitions Committee decide whether or not to factor out that result

if a club doesn't fulfil a fixture it loses 2 points and still has to play the fixture at a later date.

Unfortunately where "Front Row Leg-end" says>>>>>>

The way it works is that the league won't recognise it if it starts with uncontested scrums and therefore the same penalty applies to Tech as if they never even travelled>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

he is mistaken. That is not the case at all.

There are no insurance implications either re playing with uncontested scrums as suggested by "Front Row Leg-end" whether the match started with them or they were implemented during the game otherwise why would the RFU rules permit the game to be played in that manner...have a look at the match result card....the boxes are there to tick...it's in black and white....you don't even need to look up what particular law or rule it is that covers that situation.....

and I am totally confused at the suggestion that this would not be safe....by very definition the scrums would be safer as they are "UNCONTESTED"

surely the ref would penalise a player / team who "contested" in the scrum...... so contetsting the scrum would be pointless......

taking it to the extreme....the only danger would be that the team who did then contest at the scrum could very well be playing with less than the 15 they started with.........

ok, it wouldn't affect the result but they'd be minus that player for however many weeks he got banned for...could be quite lengthy I wudda thort for doing that kinda stoopid thing

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think you'll find I'm not....

good luck TECH



Post Edited (23-10-08 06:40)

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
JASONYARM (IP Logged)
23 October, 2008 09:24
OZOB,
FOR WHAT ITS WORTH YOU ARE 100%
I HAVE JUST CHECKED WITH THE RFU RULES AND A REF.

So can someone at TDSOB do the same.

You did not have to have -2pts in any game.

The game would of been able to go ahead with uncontested srums, and yes you lose whatever the score, but you dont get -2pts or have to play the game at a later date.

Also the 30 plus guys and supporters get to see a game of rugby.

Get it sorted lads.

(tec sec, front row leg end, what the fudge)

Good look with the rest of the season, we should not see another -2pts then?

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
TechSec (IP Logged)
23 October, 2008 10:30
OZOB & JASONYARM, all at TECH appreciate your concerns at the situation we find ourselves in and welcome your support. However, we do not agree with your interpretation of the RFU regulations, nowhere does it state that is permissible to start a LEAGUE fixture with uncontested scrums,
"friendly" games are a totally different matter and I would agree that there are referees who are perhaps willing to be flexible in their interpretations in which category a game should be placed. At the end of the day it is the players who must decide if the game should go ahead, it has already happened to us this season that a visiting team declined to play a "friendly". Finally, may I stress that we are trying our utmost to field a team and fulfill our fixtures. Thanks again for all the messages of support.

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Ozob (IP Logged)
23 October, 2008 16:57
Sorry about this TECHSEC.....no disrespect but you are wrong my friend....whoever is telling you to interpret it the way you are is wrong also.....if you don't believe me....1. ring your league secretary.......2. look at the match result card like I said re the boxes the ref has to tick...they are there for the league sec's info.......believe me I know this for a fact 100%.....

ring your league sec mate ...he will explain it to you.

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
TechSec (IP Logged)
24 October, 2008 16:08
Ozob, still looking for this box on the result card that says you can START a game with uncontested scrums, perhaps you can call in our club Saturday tea time and point it out to me (be happy to buy you a pint and discuss our problems).:-)
Jasonyarm, you are most welcome as well!

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Ozob (IP Logged)
24 October, 2008 16:34
TechSec....

apologies.....I reffered to the box on the card incorrectly..... but it's re the starting with uncontested scrums....it's 2 lines above the "REFEREE'S NAME" section.....

it reads..."Tick box if match played under Game Regulation 18.6 (0-0 win)"

that is the regulation that says you HAVE to start with uncontested scrums

Hope this helps.....good luck mate....

sadly not at your very pleasant and hospitable club which I know your members built with their very own hands...bravo on that point and good luck 2moro

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
TechSec (IP Logged)
24 October, 2008 18:14
Ozob, Sorry to have to correct you again, regulation 18.6 comes into force only when you have started a game with unregistered players, read Regulation 7.3.1 (B) Which quite clearly states that our level (8) in the interest of safety you must start with 4 players who are suitably trained and experienced to be capable of playing in the front row. Believe me we are as frustrated as anyone, but as a club we have to abide by the rules.

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Ozob (IP Logged)
24 October, 2008 20:06
Tech Sec......

Cupla things.....

1. I have to concede that I have pointed out the wrong box to tick for starting a match with uncontested scrums as you are quite correct in pointing out that Reg 18. 6 only comes into force when you have started a game with unregistered players. So it's the other box that should be ticked when you start a match with uncontested scrums as although it says on the match card - "Tick the box if the match is completed with uncontested scrums"...it doesn't say you can't start with uncontested scrums.

and....

2. If you read Reg 7.3.1 (d) it says - "The Committee (in your case the Northern Competitions Committee) may review the circumstances in every case where a match is completed with or contained uncontested scrums." This reinforces the fact that a team can start a match with uncontested scrums.

The words - "In the interests of safety......" at at the start of Reg 7.3.1 (b) only refers to IF a match is played with "contested" scrums.....no where does it say a team has to START with contested scrums and it has no bearing on if a match is STARTED with uncontested scrums.....otherwise why would the rules of the game permit uncontested scrums if it wasn't safe???? The last line of Reg 7.3.1 (b) clarifies that where it talks of continuing to play safely with contested scrums.

The point about uncontested scrums being safe is reinforced by the wording in Reg 7.3.1 (c) which says in layman's terms.....that once you have lost one front row, then lose another front row....the referee has to ask the captain of the team (or manager or Coach) who lost those 2 front row, whether they have anyone else suitably trained or experienced - because nowhere does it say you can't have more than the minmum number of front row players in your squad - if the answer is no....the referee then has to ORDER (the exact words in the regulation) the match to continue with uncontested scrums.

Now if it wasn't safe to have uncontested scrums then .... (a) why are they permitted????? and (b) why does it say that the the referee has to ORDER the game to continue the game with uncontested scrums?????

Sorry about this Tech Sec mate but I think you'll find either your league secretary / Northern Competitions Committee will say I'm right.

Good Luck on finding some more front row guys though.



Post Edited (24-10-08 21:15)

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
The Neck (IP Logged)
24 October, 2008 20:26
any refs reading this? think your input here would be helpful in clearing this issue up?

 
Re: 18TH's Oct Game
Front Row Leg-end (IP Logged)
25 October, 2008 21:29
Any solicitors reading this?





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Re: 18TH's Oct Game
HYst (IP Logged)
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